Could you please try to give me an
explanation as to what I have found?
Earliest time of God and Noah's flood 2500
B.C.
Add from 1 A.D. 2008 (Now) 2008 A.D. Equals
4508 years of time from the world wide
flood.
Bristlecone pine trees, one tree, rings
counted at 4,862 years in 1964 A.D. Add 44
years to today 2008. Equals 4906 years from
seed. If This tree is now 4906 years old and
the flood took place 5084 years ago, do the
math.
The trees are 4906 years old and still
living, The Flood 4508 years ago These trees
were living 398 years before the flood, at a
mountain elevation of half that of Mt Ararat
16,854 Ft.
What do you think? Bill |
Bill,
I've read about the Bristlecone pine trees
and I have no doubt that they
are every bit as old as their rings tell us,
including those that are older
than the time of Noah's flood. In resolving
this issue keep a few things in
mind:
1. The waters of Noah's flood were 'fresh
water' that came down as rain.
That precipitation, which is lighter than
salt water, would rest as a 'lens'
atop the ocean's water. Fact: the trees were
submerged in fresh water.
2. The trees are found at an altitude of 16K
feet above sea level. The flood
waters would have covered these trees for
less time than the full year of
Noah's flood, because of their altitude and
because the receding waters
would have uncovered them months before
trees near sea level.
3. The waters of Noah's flood were
relatively gentle in their rise and fall
(fueled by precipitation), which means they
were not subjected to strong
currents and the power of rushing streams.
Conclusion: The trees would not
have been uprooted or destroyed by the
flood.
4. Certain trees can survive prolonged
submersion in fresh water and
recover. The fact that the Dove plucked a
fresh leaf from an onlive tree and
brought it to Noah at flood's end tells us
that. There could have been no
leaf available if an olive tree had not
survived the prolonged submersion
somewhere close to where the Ark was at that
time.
So, if you look at it logically, there is no
problem with the old trees.
I hope this is helpful.
God bless.
Gaines Johnson'
|
|
(Note: We attempted to answer this
gentleman's question directly by email, but the sender's mail host
rejected the response. It is such an important question, I decided
to openly answer it here. It addresses the same question in the
message immediately below this one.)
I am glad that you take a stand on
what you believe. And I am also glad to read that you use the King
James Version. I just have one question. When reading my Bible I
found a verse in II Peter chapter two. In verse five the Apostle
Peter through the inspiration of the Holy Spirit writes of the old
world. The verse says "And spared not the old world". He then goes
on to write "but saved Noah the eighth person". This passage if of
no doubt referring to the Noah's flood of Genesis. Why in this
passage would he refer to the flood of genesis and then in II Peter
3:5-7 refer to "a previous populated earth." If you are right and
the Bible is infallible, which it is, then how can you explain the
contradiction that appears if you are right. Please email me. I
would like to know.
Charles
|
Charles,
I understand your point and it is a
natural assumption to make that 2 Peter 3:5-7 is a reference by
Paul back to his discussion of Noah's flood in 2 Peter 2:5.
Many believers assume this. However, if you read the verse immediately preceding 2 Peter
3:5-7 you will see the true context of the verses in question:
2 Peter 3:4: "And saying, Where is
the promise of his coming? for since the fathers fell asleep,
all things continue as they were from the
beginning of the creation."
The context of what follows is a
reference back to the time of the seven days of Genesis, not
Noah's flood. It is a reference to the judgment that fell on the
old preAdamite world, by water.
That context is verified by the
verse that follows the passage:
2 Peter 3:8: "But, beloved, be
not ignorant of this one thing, that one day is with the Lord as
a thousand years, and a thousand years as one day."
What do days
being equated to a thousand years have to do
with Noah's flood. Nothing! But the seven days of Genesis are a
prophetic type of the seven thousand years of human history of
this present creation, with the last 1000 being the day of rest,
the 1000 years of the Kingdom of the Lord's reign on the earth,
spoken of in Revelation 21.
If you couple these contextual
brackets, with the other points I outlined on the website, it
makes for a sound argument. The Scriptures are infallible, and
they can not be broken.
You may not agree with this line
of reasoning, but thank you for asking.
Gaines
|
Dear
Sir,
I am a believer who also rightly
divides. The issue of a gap theory
is something that I recently have
heard of and started studying. I
have not come to any conclusions,
but am deeply bothered by a couple
of things on your site. The first
is what I believe is a twisting of
scripture. You state that 2 Peter
3:5-7 is not referring to Noah. I
believe that if you take this in
context, you will see that this is
referring to Noah and the flood. I
this passage there is a warning to
beware of scoffers who deny the
promise of God concerning his
coming. There main issue is that
all things have continued as they
were from the beginning of
creation. The defense against
these scoffers is that God did in
fact punish the world with a flood
and that the world that then was
perished with water. I believe that
this verse is still in the context
of 2 Peter 2. In order to shorten
this letter, let's look specifically
at 2 Peter 2:5 " And spared not the
old world, but saved Noah the eighth
person, a preacher of righteousness,
bringing in the flood upon the world
of the ungodly;" This passage is
talking about the judgement by God
will SURELY come to these false
prophets and teachers. God is
showing this by what he has done in
the past to judge people who do the
same and the most significant of
these was bringing the flood upon
the world of the ungodly. We know
that God will not destroy the world
with a flood again, however, he
surely will judge the world. I
believe that the scoffers in 2 Peter
3 are in essence saying God will not
judge the world. Not admitting the
judgement with the flood as
referenced in 2 Peter and saying the
world has been the same since the
beginning and there has been no
judgement. Also note in 2 Peter 2:5
it refers to an "old world" which
also ties in nicely to 2 Peter
3:5-7. Please share with me your
views on my interperation of
scripture.
The other thing that bothers me
about the site is the sarcasm used
when talking about people who
believe in New Earth Creation. I
tend to lean towards NEC, but am
trying to honestly and openly study
scripture to come to an
understanding. The sarcasm and
critical comments offend rather than
draw in. I find that it attacks the
NEC believer rather than sharing
scripture in love.
Best regards,
David
|
Hello and
God bless you for your courageous stand.
I am a graduate of Hyles Anderson
College in '96, but I also graduated
from Wabash College in '87 with a
science area of concentration. I have
been studying for a couple of years now
on this issue and am thrilled to have
found your site last week. I am 90%
convinced that you are right. For years
I have tried to reconcile my beliefs
with some "unexplainable" scientific
fact. Before reading your site, I was
nearly convinced that the universe had
to be extremely old. Recently I finished
reading Show Me God, by Fred Heeren,
which has almost persuaded me
completely. Now I have seen your
Scriptural study and am fascinated.
Thank you for your work. If you are ever
in the Delaware OH area, I would love to
meet with you. I am the administrator of
a Christian school at Grace Baptist
Church, independent, fundamental, KJV,
etc. If you are speaking publicly
anywhere, please list your schedule.
Thanks again.
Eric |
|
I found your site quite by accident while searching
for other material. But as I read I realized you
were stating the same things I have believed for the
past 48 years and had been called crazy, out of the
mainstream and a lot of other names just by
mentioning what I believed...
Thanks
Aaron
|
|
I am very shocked to see the reportings on this
website. I have faith and believe in Jesus but did
not realize how close the world is to an end. I
first thought most people just felt like saying it
since the topic has been covered for few hundred if
not thousands of years. My own studies and
interpretions of some of the articles along with
many hours of my personal studies has opened my
mind, specially over the last few days. I want to
grow in my faith and want my roots to be strong
unlike many other times I have turned to GOD and
then back to the earthly ways. I would like to say
"Thank You" and may GOD bless the person in charge
of this website with many folds. One sole is saved
and the seed has been fertlized. Again Thank You for
obeying GOD and doing work in the name of GOD/Jesus,
Amen
|
|
Hi,
I find this site very in depth. I use to ascribe to
Dr. Hovind's presentation as well as Answers in
Genesis etc, until one day it was pointed out to me
what the "gap" in the Gap Theory actually was. I
used to believe that the Gap Theory was a form of
Theistic Evolution that denied the literal 24hr 6
creation days. When Genesis 1:2 was presented to me
in its context, it was the first time I actually
understood Gen.1:2. Another thing that was pointed
out to me is that God NEVER creates anything without
form and void, and the words without form and void
are the condition of the Earth after destruction,
not creation...Thanks for this great info and God
Bless - Steve
|
Dear Gaines,
After
scanning your work my insatiable curiosity kicked in
so I put the search engine to work with these
terms: “Creation Ruin Reconstruction”. I was
rewarded with nearly 800,000 hits, most of which
consist of Young Earthers desperately trying to dis-credit
the ‘Gap Theory’ mindset.
My
personal criteria: If it makes sense, I accept it.
The ‘Young Earth’ version does not make sense. The
Bible, science, and geology make sense, ‘nuff said.
God bless you
in your work,
Gene
Martinsburg, WV
|
Dear Bro. Johnson,
GREAT SITE!! I have been on it the last two nights!!
Please KEEP UP the great work!!
You're helping sinner and saint alike...at least, the
OPEN-MINDED ONES!
I was convinced of the gap 'theory' (Why is it STILL
called a theory?) a few years ago,
by a book by Dr. Donald Grey Barnhouse: The Invisible
War;
G H Pember's book also pitched in: Earth's Earliest
Ages.
I applaud your courage in presenting this ACCURATE view
of creation chronology, which so many Christians WON'T
CONSIDER!!
I was talking to dear sister tonight, about the 'gap',
and she pulled out her Bible, and said ---
'Show me in here where it is written (that there was a
civilization here BEFORE Adam and Eve)!'
People have trouble understanding that GOD did not SPELL
OUT EVERYTHING in HIs word;
if HE did, at least 2 problems would arise:
1 - the book itself would be TOO BIG, with too many
subjects, and the salvation issue would not have the
central position GOD intended the Bible to give it.
There would be too much 'distraction' in His book...the
devil provides enough of that as it is.... :)
2 - if He spoon fed us info, what need would we have to
SEEK Him for more understanding / revelation of Him?
God wants to be SOUGHT by men; this act of seeking, in
turn, changes our character for the better, making us
more like Jesus (as we spend time in study and prayer to
God for more knowledge of Him).
Further, God created a MARVELOUS THING when He made the
human MIND...
I think He takes pleasure in seeing us apply our reason
in pursuit of godly truth, using the inductive reasoning
process to derive truth that is written 'just beneath
the surface' of the words on the page, just as you do
with your discussion of 2 Pet. 3:5-7.
Did you ever make something, and then stand back with
great pleasure and watch it WORK? Again, I have to
believe GOD ENJOYS seeing humans apply their vast mental
ability to a greater understanding of Him.
Further, I have noticed in my life, when I have truly
HUNGERED for truth, He has provided it, often, even
usually, in a way that lets me know it HAD to be
Him...Just Saturday, I was contemplating the 'water
canopy' idea, I had seen in one of Dr. Clarence Larkin's
books...that very night, when I asked God to 'take me
somewhere of great interest on the web' --- He landed me
on your site for the first time. I think I sat there for
over 2 hours, reading with great joy and delight....
In conclusion, here is something the Holy Ghost told me
about studying God's word, which I think you will
appreciate
- I paraphrase:
'MANY TIMES, it is JUST as IMPORTANT, as you read my
Word, to not only ask yourself -
What is God saying?...
but, to also ask yourself -
What is God NOT saying?
Doing this will help you understand more...'
GOD BLESS!
Jim - Union, New Jersey
|
|
Hi
I'd like to thank you so much for this website.
I never wanted to get involved with the whole Evolution debate,
but my mind just did not want to let it go. When I first heard
the theories of Creation Science, I was happy to accept it, and
it strengthened my faith. Being a person who often talk before I
think, and full of confidence that what I've heard is the
falsification of 200 years of science, I jumped into the EvC
debate. To my horror, I saw all my creationist arguments shot to
pieces. Needless to say, this brought along a lot of doubts.
It went on and off for a couple of years, but in the past few
months I got closer to loosing my faith than ever before. The
realization got through to me that if the earth was young, then
you should not have to be a Christian to be able to see that in
geography. And if Genesis 1 is wrong about creation, us and
death, what does that say about Jesus? The only think that kept
me was the Holy Spirit - and previous books of the miraculous
accounts of missionaries, especially the book called "I dared to
call Him Father". I knew that I am able to believe in the (YEC
version) Genesis account, despite all the scientific evidence,
but what about the day I've got children of my own? The idea of
them loosing their faith due to my inability to understand the
conflict made it imperative that I find the answer. I took the
issue to God.
I prayed : God, you are the Creator of all things, you know the
answer. If you did use evolution and millions of years to create
the world, why didn't You just say so in the Bible? Surely You
must have KNOWN that a false creation story will lead to doubts
once we've discovered the truth. And if creationism is true, why
are non-believers not finding evidence of it in nature? You are
the author of both the bible and nature, and You Yourself said
you reveal yourself in nature. If Genesis 1 is true, how must we
understand the evidence of geology? The evolutionists say if You
planted it there to test our faith, You are dishonest. Lord, how
do I explain this? What must I answer? It is the glory of Your
Name that is at stake here.
I was angry with God that this apparent conflict existed. I've
never dared to be angry with God before, but on this issue, I
really was really angry, but I also trusted Him to provide the
answer. And sure enough, questions was raised in my mind, like :
if we were created immortal, why would there have been a Tree of
Life in Eden? Why was there a special garden if the entire
world was perfect? After announcing our punishment, God did not
change the conditions in Eden, instead Adam and Eve was chased
out. Could this mean that death already existed outside the
garden? Was death a direct result of sin, or was our separation
from the Tree of Life the direct cause? Was Immortality just
meant for us, or all living things? Wanting to explore these
issues with people who believe in the literal understanding of
Genesis, I raised them on a Christian forum, which, in turn lead
me to your website.
The Gap solution is elegant, so clean, so SIMPLE, that I was
dumbstruck on why I didn't think of this myself? Not billions of
years OR 6000 years, but billions of years AND 6000 years. It IS
possible not to have to choose between a literal understanding
of the Bible, and the scientific data. The Bible is about God's
relationship with US. What happened before the recreation, is
irrelevant and that's why the Bible don't mention it in detail.
Your website has restored my inner conflict with my faith, I
don't have to feel threatened by science anymore, and I read
with interest all your articles.
Regards
|
|
Dear Gaines,
I'm not a particularly scientifically minded Christian, politics is more
my field but I have found your site to be informative and
understandable. It has answered a number of question I couldn't
comprehend regarding creation.
One thing I still don't understand is what the purpose of the pre-Adamite
race was? How do know they are pre-Adamite? Were they in someway related
to fallen angels/nephilim or satan? Its not particularly important but
it plays on my mind!
I've studied prohecy quite a bit and the gap theory does tie in with
post-trib, pre-armageddon events i.e the sun going dark and then "being
turned back on" for the milennial rule. There do seem to be similarities
between the two events.
My understanding is that the sun will not give it's light i.e "turned
off" rather than be obscured by cloud cover. Either way, whichever view
is right it will not change the fact that Jesus is coming back!
Many thanks
Steve
|
|
Mr. Johnson,
Would you
elaborate on the fact that ancient hominids do not share our DNA? It
seems to me that this fact alone destroys any structure that
supports the young earth theory.
Thank you.
Lawrence
|
Hi Lawrence,
You are absolutely correct in your reasoning. To date, any
successful DNA extractions from "ancient hominids" reveals they are
NOT genetically related to modern humans. Mainline evolutionary
science, of course, interprets this fact as evidence that these
hominids must have been a separate and ancient "branching off" of
humanity that eventually dead ended. Consequently, they must then
reason that this branching off must have happened back far earlier
in time than previously thought. That is a logical evasion of the
problem based on that paradigm.
And, as you correctly reasoned, the fact that the DNA from ancient
hominids does not reveal a genetic connection between them and
modern man does, indeed, logically suggest that, contrary to Young
Earth Creationists beliefs, those "ancient hominids" could NOT be
some deformed or lost branch of man, post Adam, and directly
descended from Adam, else they would have the DNA of modern man (all
from Adam and through Noah's bloodline).
These two facts do, indeed, falsify both the theory of Young Earth
Creationism AND the theory of evolution, concerning the ancestry of
modern man. Good luck, however, on getting either side to accept
this. Our Bible, of course, when rightly-divided, explains the DNA
issue with clarity. The Bible can not and will not contradict the
observable facts of God's creation (and DNA is certainly a part of
His work).
Thanks for writing.
Gaines
|
I thought the following words of
Matthew Henry would bless you.....for they certainly were and are a
blessing to me. I dare not even mention "earth's age," lest most
Christians think it is heretical to even think that earth is more
than 6000 years old....they think you're an evolutionist rather than
a creationist! Foolishness! It just shows they're not yet able to
rightly divide the word of truth. I have had your website
book-marked under my "Favorites" for a long time.
Concerning the first verse in Genesis, Matthew Henry said: "The
first verse of the Bible gives a surer and better, a more satisfying
and useful knowledge of the origin of the universe, than all the
Volumes of the Philosophers."
He went on to say, "The lively faith of humble Christians
understands this matter better than the elevated fancy of the most
learned."
Awaiting His return,
Jean (a salty saint)
Louisville, KY |
Dear sir,
let's say I was once believer in Christ, but as the geological (and
astronomical, etc.) evidences gradually comes to me, I began to doubt
God's existence. On one side there were evidences prooving the Earth is
approximately 4 billions of years old; but on the other hand I come to
know that the life without God (and thus without any meaning of life) is
too depressive and meaningless. So that was a real problem which I just
could not resolve. I could not believe in God, whose Scripture says that
the Earth is only 6,000 years old, while modern science evidences say
the Earth is 4 billions of years old. Then I just come across your web
site, and many questions seems to be answered; and I begin to trust God
again. So here's my only question which I ask you sincerely to answer:
Can you please explain more widely the chronology of the old Earth time
- i.e. the period between Gen. 1:1, and Gen. 1:2? Why God created
firstly the "sons of God" (i.e. angels, and all the pre-Adamite beings),
and what about all the other creatures like dinosaurs, trilobites,
hominides - how did they evolve? Where they created by God at first, or
did they evolve (as some kind of evolution) from the fallen angels? I
know there is too little about that in the Bible (maybe because God's
main interest now being us, and not the old creation), but I would be
really thankful to you if you can suggest some answers.
PS: I have read all the articles on your website, as well as Pember's
"Earth's Earliest Ages", but although it solved the main problem between
faith in God and modern science, still there are some questions to left.
Yours sincerely,
Marcel G. (Czech Republic)
|
Dear
Marcel,
I know EXACTLY where you are coming from, because I was once their
myself.
And I wish I could provide further details on your questions, but I am
still
trying to find some of those answers myself.
I rejoice in hearing that my website has answered enough of your
questions
for you to again trust in the Lord Jesus Christ. After all, THAT is the
most
important question every man and woman must deal with, and it has
eternal
consequences. And, although you may have let go of Christ because of all
the
confusion and disinformation, He obviously did not let go of you. -
smile!
Here is a link to a set of good research pages on the Angels and
pre-adamites.
http://www.ichthys.com/Default.htm#Rebellion
Although I disagree with the author's position on the eternal security of the
Believer, most of his stuff appears to be spot on. Perhaps you will find
some more answers on that website.
If you trust in God's Word, and believe that He can provide you with the
answers you seek, He will do it. He has already started that process
with
you.
I'm sorry that I can't be more helpful on the specifics of your
question,
but the PreCambrian/Cambrian is the place in deep time where the answer
is
to be found. That much I know.
God bless.
Gaines Johnson
|
The evidence for the Earth's age shows that the earth is not
billions of years old. You must take into account a worldwide flood
that happened roughly 4400 years ago. In this scenario, fossil fuel
was created in a short amount of time, not in thousands or billions
of years. The Flood also created the Grand Canyon which did not
take thousands or milions of years to form. It is good not to take
information from uneducated evolutionary scientists who do not
consider The Flood and try to fit it with Genesis. There are many
more scientific evidences showing the Earth to be young.
Hebrew scholars all agree that the word 'day' in the Genesis
creation account was translated from a Hebrew word meaning a
24-hour-day.
There are also theological errors with the Gap Theory such as how it
puts death before sin.
Genesis can be read and understood for face value as involving
literal 24-hour-days. It's not until you take some view outside of
the bible that you get this idea for the Gap Theory. There is no
scriptural evidence in the bible for the Gap Theory. We do not need
a guru or over-analyzed interpretation to tell us what the bible
says.
Josh |
|
Dear Mr. Jouhnson,
Thank you so much for your web
site. I am a Homeschool mom. Almost all curriculum I find to
use for Science is Young Earth creation. I have never agreed
with this.
My father is a pastor. He has
always taught the Gap Theory at our church, even though a few
have opposed this. He has always went back to the original
Hebew to show his belief. I believe this is the only correct
way to interpet the scripture.
When I was in high school, I was
taught the Theory of Evolution as fact. It was the first time I
had doubted my Salvation. This
had me super confused for several years. When I heard my Dad
teach the Gap Theory for the first time, everything became so
clear. The Bible proves Science.
The Lord has laid such a burden on
my heart for youth who are in the same situation that I found
myself in, in high school. This summer I am going to teach a
Youth Bible Study class at my church. We are going to start
with the Creation verses Evolution debate. With guidance from
the Lord, I am going to include the Gap Theory in this class.
It is almost impossible to find
information that is pro Gap Theory. Thank you for your site.
The information on here will be a tremendous help to me.
Love in Christ,
Amy
|
| Dear Sir, I just wanted to inform
you that I would be careful if I were you in your "interpretation"
of Genesis1:1 and 1:2. Namely, you are calling God a liar. Woe unto
you. There was no death before Adam sinned. Read Romans 5:12,"
Wherefore, as by one man( Adam) sin entered into the world, and
death by sin, so death passed upon all men, for that all have
sinned." |
Thanks so much for
posting your virtual debate with "Dr. Dino."
I have an online friend who is sending me some tapes of Dr. Hovind's
"scientific proof" of creation science, and his specific version
thereof. I wasn't familiar with his work prior to hearing of him
from this friend.
I was looking for some creationist details for different research
when I stumbled upon your "virtual debate". I've just skimmed it and
find it
absolutely entrancing. I had the feeling, based on what my online
friend had said about the information on the tapes that the tapes
would contain a circular, self-serving presentation. Even Dr.
Hovind's challenge for anyone to prove his "science" is incorrect
seems fishy to me, since I suspect he will not allow the judging of
whether a challenger's proof is adequate by anyone other than a
Believer, which by definition would make the proof insufficient as
work of an Unbeliever.
You certainly have pegged this guy. After I listen to the tapes, I
will no doubt come back to your website for my "rebuttal arguments",
and my friend will be very disappointed that I don't buy into Dr.
H's theories. So far, it would appear that his response to people
not buying into Dr. H's theories is that the person isn't willing to
know the Truth -- since they're not believing the same Truth he is.
This will be a very interesting interaction.
I don't have much patience for theologians or theorists that base
their doctrine on a document (in this case the Bible) but then can't
decide whether the text is literal or metaphorical, whether it is
the Word of God, or the Word of Man translating the Word of God, and
change their position to be whatever supports the particular theory
they're trying to substantiate. Pick one side of the fence and stay
on it, I say! Hovind definitely jumps back and forth, as you so
astutely point out in several areas of your virtual debate.
Thanks again, and keep up the Good Work!
Chris |
Dear Mr.
Johnson,
I found this site after doing a search for some information
concerning the Gap Theory. I am a member of the Westover Baptist
Church in Hattiesburg, MS and my father is the pastor.Recently, a
group of our church's youth and some adults took a trip to Florida
and visited Dr. Dino's (Kent Hovind) Dinosaur Park. One of our
members purchased his video tape "The Age of the Earth" and it was
shown during a couple of our Sunday School classes. As I was
watching it, I noticed many errors in his science, his continually
contradicting himself, and his loose interpretation of scripture.
However, Hovind chooses to mask his lessons in comedy so that you
laugh instead of think about what he said, even though his message
in ingrained in the mind of the listener. I commented to one guy
after watching the video that he uses a lot of comedy in his
presentation, but if you ignore the comedy and listen to what he's
saying, you find youself thinking "wait, that isn't right". Some of
our members were taken in by this style so I was doing some research
to find some info to present the "other side" of the argument.
I found your site and spent several days reading and studying the
information provided. I found your site to be very valuable and
told my father about it. I was wondering if this information was
provided in a book form. My father has very slow dial up connection
and I have cable internet, so he can't spend a lot of time logged on
reading the site. I tried to copy the html onto a disk, but I lose
several of the links, such as the "mouse-over" of certain hebrew
words. I tried printing each page, but he print format came out
sort of messed up. If this information could be provided in book
form, it would be very valuable to those who don't have internet
access and I would be glad to purchase copies to place in our
church's library.
One reason I was trying to get this information to my father was
because when my father heard about the tape being viewed in Sunday
School, he asked to borrow it. He watched it at home and was so
bothered by it that he woke up in middle of the night thinking about
it. My father wanted to prepare a video with him discussing what
Hovind said with excerpts from Hovind's video. My father was mainly
discussing the errors in Hovind's use or misuse of scripture. But
since my father also has a degree in math and lacked only a couple
of courses before getting a second degree in physics, he was able to
explain some of Hovind's science errors. My father spent several
years working with NASA in satellite tragectory in the 60's before
surrendering to the ministry. His knowledge of orbits allowed him
to explain how the moon is NOT getting further from the earth, the
earth's slowing down, and certain other science. Hovind contends
that the moon is getting further from earth, meaning that the earth
couldn't be millions of years old or the moon would have been
extremely close to the earth.
As a registered professional civil engineer, I have certain
knowledge that I can debate many of Hovind's assumptions. Hovind is
extremely selective in his use of science. He searches and finds
science from any source that will support his assumptions and ignore
the vast amounts of science that contradicts his theories.
The video that my father prepared was shown in Sunday School this
morning, but I have not heard of the results or comments from the
audience because my father is preaching a revival this week and I
was at that church service.
One disagreement or question concerning an interpretation of
scripture is in Jeremiah 4: 23-28. I mentioned to my father that
you believe that verse is describing the tribulation and not the
earth in Genesis. He believes that the scripture is not describing
the tribulation because the earth does not become without form and
void, but would if not for Jesus. The earth became without form and
void because of the the sin of Satan and the same would happen to
this world if not for the salvation of Jesus. I suppose if
believing that the scripture is referring to Genesis, then the
meaning of the word "cities" would have to be determined. Does
"cities" mean structures built by man or does it refer to dwellings
of prehistoric "man" and animals? I am going to get him a copy of
this site to read and I have been studying it myself. Like I
mentioned before, a book form of this site would be very valuable.
I have not used the term "Dr. Hovind" because I still haven't found
evidence of his receiving a doctorate. I've known of others who
refer to themself as "Doctor" after receiving an honorary
doctorate. I've always viewed honorary doctorates as symbolic only,
such as a key to the city. The key doesn't really open anything and
an honorary doctorate doesn't mean you are a real doctor. Maybe he
prefers to refer to himself as "Dr. Hovind" to lend credence to his
theories. Also, he claims that by watching his college course on
video series, you can receive college credit, thus, he MUST be a
professor! All I've been able to learn about his education or
credentials is that he taught high school for 15 years. I guess my
biggest question is why are there those like Hovind who are so
obsessed with the earth being only 6,000 years old, when it is
contrary to science and scripture? To me, Satan gets a bye in that
theory. In believing the Gap Theory, you must believe that when
Satan sinned, he was unable to save the earth that he was in charge
of. God placed Lucifer over the earth in the beginning and when
Lucifer sinned by thinking he was as powerful as God, he failed and
the earth died, or became without form and void. By believing as
YEC do, there is no failure by Satan. He simply appeared on earth
tempting Adam and Eve.
Thank you for your time in reading this e-mail and again, I am very
glad to have found your site. It is very informative and gives me a
lot to study and to use in informing others of Hovind's erred
theories. I have given this link to others and I will be visiting
this site again.
Dave Steele |
Hi Dave,
Thank you for sharing your thoughts and concerns. I've had several
requests over the years for a printed copy of my website's material,
but have resisted doing so while still researching and updating. As
a policy I freely allow anyone to copy and print off anything from
the site and use it as the Lord leads. I'm also aware that,
sometimes, the html pages do not print off easily. Sorry about that,
but that is a drawback of coding the pages for interactive Internet
presentation.
Right now I am starting the long process of creating a new website
presentation on another ISP using a professional content management
software package. When completed there will be (Lord willing)
printer-friendly versions of the pages available. In the meantime
please feel free to copy off anything you can and use it as you see
fit.
With your permission, I would like to post a copy of your letter on
my website's letters to the webmaster page. I believe that what you
have so well written would be a helpful testimony to others who may
have made similar observations.
Again, thanks for writing and my regards to your father.
God bless.
Gaines |
Mr. Johnson,
I want to thank you for your web site, "Christian Geology Ministry".
I discovered it by accident while trying to find information on the
Pre-Adamite World. The information you provide makes the whole
picture incredibly clear. Just as you say, the message has been
there all along. Even as a child, I was always puzzled by Christian
Ministers who said that the world cannot be more than 6-8,000 years
old. My Grandmother was a fine Christian woman. I remember asking
her when I was just a child. " If the Earth is only 6,000 years old,
where did the dinosaur bones come from. They are supposed to be
millions of years old?" Her answer was, "The old Devil just put them
here to confuse us." I had never heard of the Gap Theory until I
started studying out of the Scofield Reference Bible, KJV. You put
it all in perspective. I still have some unanswered questions, which
I would like to discuss with you sometime. But for now, I love your
web-site.
Larry |
If the universe was
“destroyed” 12,000 years ago along with the sun and the stars then
how is it that we can still see the light generated from those stars
older than 12,000 light years? You seem to be saying that the light
rays generated prior to 12,000 years were not destroyed. If they
were not destroyed then what are you saying happened with the
universe was made void?
Kevin |
Kevin,
I suppose I should clarify the term "destroyed" in this context. The
laws of physics tell us that matter or energy can not be destroyed.
It can be converted from one form to another (mass to energy e=mc2)
but not destroyed. Since light is a form of energy, then ancient
starlight can not be destroyed. It would be better to say that the
universe was "ruined" and that would better convey the intended
meaning and match the word "void" in that context. Thanks for you're
letter. I'll edit the text appropriately.
|
Greetings Mr. Johnson.
You have a wonderful website that I've been greatly enjoying for a
while now. I had been reading many Anti-Gap theory websites lately
and finally discovered your Pro-Gap Theory site. It is fascinating.
You have a lot of biblical and scientific weight behind your
beliefs. Since I tend to agree with most of what you have concluded,
I figured I'd mention one area where I think you may be mistaken. In
light of all that you have in your website, this may seem like a
"minor" point. But, I do believe it could be a major mistake.
If I understand you correctly, I question your belief that God
destroys everything at the end of the 1000 year Millennium after He
has restored, redeemed and regenerated everything. If you think
about this, it seems rather strange for God to go through all the
purging, regenerating and redeeming of mankind and the creation,
just to destroy it all later after the Millennium. Why "redeem" it
all if He is ultimately planning to destroy it again? Redeem means
to "purchase back," not "destroy" what is rightfully yours.
There are numerous Bible passages which speak of the land of Israel
as "everlasting." It will be given to the Jews as an "eternal
possession." One example is Isa.60:21 "Thy people shall all be
righteous: they shall inherit the land for ever......" In Daniel,
when it speaks of the Lord setting up His kingdom on earth, it is
stated to be an eternal kingdom "that will never be destroyed." He
won't set up His kingdom on earth and perfect it, just to destroy it
and move it to some other new earth or creation later. In Revelation
21, He's making "all things new" not "all new things." The "Day of
the Lord" followed by the Millennium is God's way and process of
ultimately making "all things new."
The judgments and plagues of Revelation, as well as during the
Millennium period, is God's plan and methods of removing what must be
permanently destroyed and restoring permanently all that was lost.
He's perfecting everything. Why would He destroy at the end of the
Millennium all that He had died and suffered for to redeem and to
make perfect?
Psalm 89:35-37 proves that the Sun and Moon will exist forever.
"Once have I sworn by my holiness that I will not lie unto David.
His seed shall endure for ever, and his throne as the sun before me.
It shall be established for ever as the moon, and as a faithful
witness in heaven."
The 1000 year Millennium is the time it takes to perfect the kingdom.
It is not the total length of the kingdom on this earth. After the
Millennium, the last thing to be destroyed is "death," not the
creation. The earth and heavens will continue on forever after the
1000 years without any further time when it could be destroyed
again. God destroyed the other "worlds" that you mention throughout
your website. We know He didn't completely "destroy out of
existence" the heavens and earth. The earth and universe was still
here after the previous "destructions." So too will the present
earth and universe remain after the Second Coming and even after the
Millennium. This creation, in which we dwell now, is to be redeemed,
not destroyed, for a perfect and eternal dwelling place.
I used to believe that this earth and universe was temporal. But now
I see from Scripture that it is eternal. Do you find my
interpretation Biblical? Or do you find Scriptural flaws with
it?
Have a wonderful day and God bless you.
Joe |
Hi Joe,
Thanks for writing. In answer to your question and your arguments,
please keep in mind that even though near perfect conditions have
been restored on the face of the earth at the start of the
Millennium;
even though the Lord Jesus is ruling over the earth with His
resurrected saints, He is reigning over the remnant of the offspring
of unregenerate mankind (we are NOT talking about saved and
resurrected Christians here) that have survived through the
tribulation and have been granted entrance into the 1000 years
kingdom. Even though the lifespan of these folks are now several
hundred years (see Isaiah 65:22) there is still death in the
Millennium (see Isaiah 65:20) of the remnant and offspring of this
remnant of people from all nations and tongues. So, although things
on the earth are "near perfect" they are not completely perfect.
That is why, at the end of the 1000 years, a released Satan is still
able to raise men in opposition to the reigning King of Kings,
although the Lord has granted them to live in a near perfect
environment, and even without Satan to tempt them. In the end,
thought, man's unregenerate nature still plagues them:
Revelation 20:7-15 "And when the thousand years are expired, Satan
shall be loosed out of his prison, And shall go out to deceive the
nations which are in the four quarters of the earth, Gog and Magog,
to gather them together to battle: the number of whom is as the sand
of the sea. And they went up on the breadth of the earth, and
compassed the camp of the saints about, and the beloved city: and
fire came down from God out of heaven, and devoured them. And the
devil that deceived them was cast into the lake of fire and
brimstone, where the beast and the false prophet are, and shall be
tormented day and night for ever and ever. And I saw a great white
throne, and him that sat on it, from whose face the earth and the
heaven fled away; and there was found no place for them. And I saw
the dead, small and great, stand before God; and the books were
opened: and another book was opened, which is the book of life: and
the dead were judged out of those things which were written in the
books, according to their works. And the sea gave up the dead which
were in it; and death and hell delivered up the dead which were in
them: and they were judged every man according to their works. And
death and hell were cast into the lake of fire. This is the second
death. And whosoever was not found written in the book of life was
cast into the lake of fire."
That is the FINAL judgment and the end of the present heavens and
earth, as we see in the first verse of the next chapter:
Revelation 21:1 "And I saw a new heaven and a new earth: for the
first heaven and the first earth were passed away; and there was no
more sea."
Yes, the Lord's Kingdom is never ending and, of course continues
through and after the Millenium, but the 1000 years at the beginning
is something special. It is there that the Son of Man reigns over
the tribes of Israel and the tribes of the earth (and the saved
saints reign with Him). It is there that the Lion of the tribe of
Judah reigns. It is there that the son of David leads the final
victory over any and all that oppose His reign.
After the end of the 1000 years all things, including Death and Hell
and Satan, are finally and completely put down:
1 Corinthians 15:25-28 "For he must reign, till he hath put all
enemies under his feet. The last enemy that shall be destroyed is
death. For he hath put all things under his feet. But when he saith
all things are put under him, it is manifest that he is excepted,
which did put all things under him. And when all things shall be
subdued unto him, then shall the Son also himself be subject unto
him that put all things under him, that God may be all in all."
And this is the reason for the specific period of the 1000 years at
the start of His reign. It is a final chance for the remnant of
unregenerate man to accept the Lord Jesus Christ...and a final
bending over backwards, so to speak, to give those folks at last
chance to avoid eternal hell and damnation. It is the Lord's full
and final vindication for the proceedings at the Great White Throne
final Judgment.
The new heaven and earth which follows (Revelation 21:1) and all
things thereafter, are eternal and full joy and piece, and no more
tears and sorrow.
I hope this has been useful to your study of this matter.
God bless
Gaines
|
Dear Mr. Johnson
What a pleasure it is to find your website and study it.
My Pastor has always taught the GAP theory using the
original hebrew of Gen. 1:2, I would refer you to
Custance.org for more information on this. Your
understanding of the KJV is remarkable as you present it
and your case is compelling. Thank you for making this
available. When I studied the Bible at Houston Baptist
College many years ago the professors always noted that
certain translations of the KJV were unusual i.e.
replenish in one place and fill in another both from the
same word in the Hebrew. The translators of the KJV
clearly knew the meaning of the word Male' and presented
the Gap theory quite clearly until I saw your website I
thought that I had to resort to my Pastor's scholarly
presentation of the Hebrew. With this website I can use
both and demonstrate that the translators of the KJV
knew what they were doing.
Thank you
Gene |
Dearest brother in Christ,
I was looking for information on the kingdom of God vs.
the kingdom of heaven and ended up on you sight. It's
been a while since I was there. To my surprise, I saw
the link to the "debate" with you and brother Hovand!
What a shock! I am the woman that wrote you originally
requesting a better format to compare the both sides of
this issue to help my boys understand the differences
compared with Scripture. We were so disappointed with
brother Hovand for refusing to accomodate our request.
I found it interesting that he found the time to list
his beliefs on his own sight after the fact but had no
time for us when we requested a similar thing. Oh
well.....Praise the Lord for providing the side by side
"debate" after all. Just printed it off and will go over
it tonight with the boys. Thank you. It took a while to
finally have the comparisons but thank the Lord we do.
Can't wait to study it out more.....
Resting safely in Christ by faith alone,
Linda |
Linda,
I too was surprised to find that Dr. Dino had put up his
anti Gap Theory article, after refusing to debate, so
what I put up was the next best thing. I know that there
are others, beside your boys, who needed to see this
comparison. But it was your efforts, and Hovind's
reactions, that inspired me to go ahead and do it. I
sincerely hope your boys gain a benefit from the
side-by-side analysis.
God bless.
Gaines
|
Sir,
I just wanted to tell you thank you for your website
on the “Gap FACT.” It has helped me so much. I have
studied out of the DAKE Annotated Bible for about 9
years now and that is where I first heard about the
Gap teaching. It answered so many questions that I
had. About 4 years ago I came across the Creation
Science teaching and it almost redirected my
thoughts but the Holy Spirit kept pulling me back
even though I now had a bunch of new questions and
couldn’t find the answers. And then- I came across
your website and I knew why the Holy Spirit wouldn’t
let me drop it. Being a deliverance minister I have
studied on demonology extensively and have come to
the conclusion that demons may be the spirits and
souls of that race of people before Gen 1:2. Thanks
for all of your information. It helped me lead one
evolutionist to the Lord last year. Is your website
in book form? I would like to know if it was. You
know, if nothing happened before Adam and Eve like
any death or sin, what would be the purpose of the
tree of knowledge of good and evil? Anyway, again
thank you.
David |
Hello.
I really like your site... very well-written,
thought-provoking and edifying
:)
My question relates to our ability to see light
produced by distant stars.
The Bible says God made the stars on the fourth
day (Genesis 1:16),
therefore after the gap window. How is it then
possible for us to see stars
that are uncontestably millions of light years
away?
More specifically, do you agree with the YEC
take on this matter
(http://answersingenesis.org/docs/405.asp)?
Thank you for addressing this and God bless you
:)
Yours in Christ,
-Patrick
|
Patrick,
Thanks for writing. You have wisely asked the
one major question that essentially remains
unanswered on my website.
First of all, I read the link you sent me and
I'm totally blown away by the
contorted time-dilation mental gymnastics
presented. I needed a good laugh!
I'm working on a new page to explain the issue,
and the answer about the
stars is simple. When you look up into the sky
at a distant star you are
looking back into historical time. What you see
when you look at a star 1
million light years away is what that star
looked like 1 million years ago.
In reality, it may no longer be there. It could
have exploded 500,000 years
ago and you would not see that from earth for
another 500,000 years.
Correct?
Using time viewed from earth as a reference,
think about this. If, about
12,000 years ago, the universe went dark due to
Satan's rebellion, and God
then regenerated the universe about 6,000 years
ago (including all the
stars), what will we soon be seeing happening in
the heavens? The answer:
Light from 12,000 years ago should be reaching
us soon:
Luke 21:25-26 And there shall be signs in the
sun, and in the moon, and in
the stars; and upon the earth distress of
nations, with perplexity; the sea
and the waves roaring; Men's hearts failing them
for fear, and for looking
after those things which are coming on the
earth: for the powers of heaven
shall be shaken.
Acts 2:19 And I will shew wonders in heaven
above, and signs in the earth
beneath; blood, and fire, and vapour of smoke:
Luke 21:11 And great earthquakes shall be in
divers places, and famines,
and pestilences; and fearful sights and great
signs shall there be from
heaven.
If the old state of the universe went out in a
blaze of stellar explosions
12,000 years or so ago, then we should be seeing
it sometime soon, just as
the Bible says. Should be quite a light show.
I hope this is helpful.
God bless.
Gaines Johnson
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